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  • Men Who Hate Women

  • From Incels to Pickup Artists, the Truth About Extreme Misogyny and How It Affects Us All
  • By: Laura Bates
  • Narrated by: Laura Bates
  • Length: 14 hrs and 27 mins
  • 4.8 out of 5 stars (824 ratings)

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Summary

Includes an exclusive interview between the author and Ben Hurst, head of facilitation and training at The Good Lad Initiative and presenter of the TedxLondonWomen talk 'Boys won’t be boys. Boys will be what we teach them to be'.

An explosive book examining the rise of secretive, extremist communities who despise women. In this ground-breaking investigation, Laura traces the roots of misogyny across a complex spiders web of groups extending from men's rights activists and pick-up artists to Men Going Their Own Way, trolls and the Incel movement, in the name of which some men have committed terrorist acts. 

Drawing parallels with other extremist movements around the world, Bates seeks to understand what attracts men to the movement, how it grooms and radicalises boys, how it operates and what can be done to stop it. 

Most urgently of all, she traces the pathways this extreme ideology has taken from the darkest corners of the internet to emerge covertly in our mainstream media, our playgrounds and our parliament. 

Going undercover on and offline, Laura provides the first, comprehensive look at this hitherto under-the-radar phenomenon, including fascinating interviews with former members of these communities, the academics studying this movement and the men fighting back.

©2020 Laura Bates (P)2020 Audible, Ltd

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Miles off!

I think this isn't a book for people living in the real world, much like Every Day Sexism. It seems to be catering to women who want to believe they are held back and aren't safe ect...

I will say, she seems to think men are proud of being an Incel, like its a badge of honour that you can't get any women to love you, its not. If you gave any incel the option of being in a relationship or being an incel, they would pick relationship! This is wholly evident by an example give in the end of the book, where an incel was completely reformed when women started being nice to him, and talking to him. Unfortunately I do believe vast majorities of women don't even see such men.

I disagreed with 98% of the book. It was well narrated and easy to listen to.... as in the voice, it never sounded robotic, not the content, the content was very difficult to listen to!

70 people found this helpful

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Women's rights are not men's wrongs

Feminist writer Laura Bates is best known for her work on the Every Day Sexism Project. In this new book she explores the "manosphere" and considers how ideas that has developed in the dark corners of the internet have seeped into mainstream consciousness. We hear of, at first, seemingly harmless "Incels" (involuntarily celibate) who provide a sense of belonging for an increased proportion of men who at their most extreme and have a deep hatred for women and have links to the alt right. We learn of pick up artists (PUAs) who are deeply misogynistic and men who pay for courses to learn how to increase the notch count on their bedposts.

Some of the depictions of toxic masculinity depicted in this book are deeply disturbing particularly as we hear the way that young people are recruited by the perpetrators by use of social media (YouTube especially) by targeting those who partake in activities such as on line gaming and body building. This is not just in the shadows though; famed author Jordan Petersen is openly misogynistic and claims this is a result of the "me too" movement that has caused men to rebel and even the Leader of the Free World, President Trump has made several potentially harmful statements about the role of women in society. Most hate crime definitions do not include gender and there are examples of attacks perpetrated by the beta male community against women that are not considered to be terrorism.

There is an interview at the end of this audio book with the author who states that she is fearful of the potential backlash this book will create. This is brave writing and Laura Bates' voice deserves to be heard.

54 people found this helpful

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Absolutely nonsensical

The problem with this sort of book is that when the author is deep into the rabbit whole that they start believing theor own nonsense, they speak with the confidence of a newly elected US President, and start spouting giberrish with such conviction that we as listener can help but want to believe them... until we take 2 seconds to actually think about it all...

46 people found this helpful

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A mindblowing uncovery of the dark and twisted web

Out of all the groups mentioned and explored in this brilliant book, the only one I had a passing familiarity with was Incels, although I had no idea at the depth and breadth of how serious and widespread a danger they represented.

This book has left me feeling shaken, scared and seriously worried, but its also woken me up to some serious issues, which we as a society need to tackle. The expression "woke" now makes sense to me.

Following this, I now plan on listening to Laura Bates' other works.

Thank you for this work, Laura. Thank you for opening my eyes.

43 people found this helpful

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The Bravest Book Ever Written

I hope Panorama picks this up soon because I think that's the only way to make All the Good Men in this world see this problem for what it is. Good men, like every man I know, just can't bear to read this information. It's too upsetting for them. Women manage it because they want to stay safe and KNOW they need to know about it, as much for their beautiful boys as the women in their lives.

35 people found this helpful

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A laughable attempt to discredit MGTOW\Red Pill

As a red piller, i like to listen to both sides of the debate.
According to the author,
Women are victims, Trump, Peterson, Milo are racists.
Milo is married to a black guy!
No one has found anything that anything that Peterson has said to be racist or sexist, he simply promotes Male responsibility and the family, all things that Feminists hate!
Many for my favorite Red Pillers are Black, but some people are racist,you find them in all walks of life, because you are red pilled or MGTOW it doesn't mean you are a racist ot Alt right.
I watch Paul Ellam and been on the voice for men website,some of what he says makes sense, some doesn't.Hes never ask me for money.
The author says, she got so many threats from men , she was scared but went to a men right meeting and guess , what nothing happen to her and there were also minorities there.
Google men domestic violence , its committed by women in 1/3 of cases, using police figures and that not considering most men would be too ashamed to report it.
Swatting is normal done by gamers.

Marriage is a risk, i got more information buying a mobile phone.

50/50 of marriages end in divorce
if your you female partner has a degree the chance , she will divorce you goes it up to 80 percent.
2nd marriages its a 70 percent divorce rate
3rd marriages its in the high 80 percent.

A man will lose his home and his children in most case.
50/50 joint access, should be the court first point of call.
87 percent of custody cases are award to the mother.

The game has changed, Men can see there no longer get a fair deal and there withdrawing and women don`t like it.
Our ideas are becoming main stream, young men are listening the word Simp has become main stream.
When you the words a strong and independent woman its seen as a postive now reverse that statement it to men
Lonelr /oddball..
Woman dont like it.
How has the Red pill helped me

1) Personal Responsibility.
2) increased my fitness.
3) Wealth, i never had so much disposal income.
4) Confidence with women , i can take them or leave them.

31 people found this helpful

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Excellent analysis of the Manosphere

I have been vaguely aware of many of the areas covered by this book, incels, mra, pua, gamergate, the alt right for sometime now but the way the writer links all of these online groups with real world actions is truly eye opening.

29 people found this helpful

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You need to read this chaps

Laura Bates' book has been positively reviewed in most of the broadsheets in the past fortnight and I have just finished listening to it.

Her aim in the book is mainly to raise awareness of the misogyny lurking on the internet (but crossing over, violently, into real life). The four groups she discusses are incels, pick up artists, mens rights activists and men going their own way. Posing as a man she infiltrates their forums and communities over a year and what she finds is very disturbing. Misogyny is everywhere; hatred and incitement to violence, rape and murder is the defining feature of incel communities, but only marginally less disturbing in this context are the views and techniques of pick up artists.

After chapters on each, replete with some of the vilest abuse you will ever read, one's hopes that these represent tiny minorities are dashed as she traces how far these views spread (all the way up, of course, to Donald Trump who receives due attention). Most worrying of all is her work in schools and how widespread misogynist views are to be found in teenage boys, and particularly influential in this context are Jordan Peterson (and to a much lesser extent Carl Benjamin). The pivotal role of Gamergate is extensively discussed in this context (especially the abuse that Anita Sarkeesian suffered).

Rapes, murders and mass killings have been carried out by members of these groups (particularly by incels), and the links between these communities and alt-right and far-right groups is extensively explored and detailed. Bates argues, and argues well, that this is a form of domestic terrorism and should be treated as such. The nexus of radicalisation, as she evidences, is YouTube. 25% of all mobile internet use is now YouTube, and 70% of what people watch are YouTube recommendations subsequent to whatever was initially viewed. YouTube's algorithm moves a viewer to more 'extreme' content and anybody looking at feminist issues will quickly be presented with anti-feminist videos to watch (just try it!). Interviews with teenagers reveal that YouTube is their primary source of misogynist views.

The 'Me Too' movement and the issue of false rape or sexual assault allegations is discussed at length. Bates presents statistical evidence to demonstrate the number of such allegations is miniscule compared to the number of rapes that take place. More importantly, however, Bates points out that if this is something that worries a man, then it is his own behaviour and views that he should be examining, rather seeing women in general as a threat or as being prone to making false allegations.

The book concludes with a discussion on what can be done about it and Bates argues that the ball is in our (men's) court; no amount of a woman and/or feminist telling men what to do will have any effect. She argues that toxic masculinity (which she carefully distinguishes from toxic men) has created problematic attitudes that we need to address and that where support is needed it must be provided. It is down to us to call this behaviour out when we see it.

This book is not some intersectional rant from somebody who hates men (though thousands hate her as she is in receipt of a constant barrage of rape and death threats) but a carefully researched, evidenced and extremely well argued book that I encourage all men to read/listen to.

27 people found this helpful

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A Book Everyone should read

The book for all that the title states is not a man-bashing book, in fact, its the opposite its a man saving book.

I did write a long review but deleted it, I think it's better you read it with an open mind and don't look up anything about the author until you have read it.

I am off to have conversations and will be listening more carefully to hear what is being said by those that I know.

24 people found this helpful

  • Overall
    2 out of 5 stars

Often politically disingenuous, and biased.

The audiobook contains some good information and anecdotal evidence on misogyny. Some of the stories are horrifying and worrying. The author has gone into exposing communities that are hateful, and sometimes dangerous to women such as incels, MRAs, and MGTOW.

However, the author hurts her argument massively as the covert misandry and confirmation bias begins to sneak in somewhere from chapter 3 onwards.

The author becomes overly dismissive and even worse gaslighting men's issues over false rape allegations and false sexual harassment allegations, which are legitimately a concern and worry for men in modern society, and not a small deal at all. In one such example in chapter 3 which disgusted me, the author conveys a snarky contempt at men leaving door open in the office to protect themselves. She mentions that if it's an issue to men, then for them to "just stop sexually assaulting women" - which is a wholely unhelpful line, a disgrace to innocent victims of false rape allegations, and highly inflammatory. It's attitudes like that, which help fuel anti-feminist rhetoric that the author presumably doesn't want, and a hardening of views. The fear of false crime accusations is further attacked in chapter 8 to the point of shamelessness.

There is also a sense of whitewashing and omissions of anything negative that has come from feminism. To a degree, this is expected. The title after all is, Men that Hate Women. But would be something that could legitimately aid the argument of the author if she would choose to be more honest. After all, any decent book on something wider such as history of The Cold War for instance, would show a balance of escalations on both sides which made the situation untenable - whichever side you agree with. The is no such balance here. Little sense of egolitarianism, (although the author gratefully raises racism within men's groups). The author quickly dismisses any double standards highlighted by MRA advocates at some feminists; of simply being false equivalences and or exaggerated distortions. The author also flippantly dismisses extreme feminists as 'few' or 'fringe' cases, despite widely painting and mass sweeping generalising groups of men. She uses extreme examples herself to strengthen her stance, whilst the author hypocritically accuses MRA of distorting statistics and cherry picking extreme examples.

Furthermore as dogmatically expected, the author uses the tired trope/narrative of blaming mens problems on their own masculinity. Everything that harms men is as expected - is apparently men's fault themselves! The author entrenches dehumanising language, and continues to gaslight men's identity of masculine ideals.

The psychological slant of misogyny explained by the author is touched upon, and both welcome and interesting. The author explains how boys and men become desensitised, groomed, indoctrinated, and radicalised on the internet. This is important, and shines a light on the trapping of people into joining groups with hateful views. The psychological angle or scope can be limited at times through. Ideally, I would have preferred a bit more substance to this, as the audiobook is devoid of language of more scientific rigor. Considering the prevalence of misogyny and violence, the author makes no mention of metal disorders of the DSM-5. Mentally ill people with traits of narcissism, personality disorders, autistic ect bare no mention within this book. Is there a link between the dark triad and misogyny? That would have been a missed research point to explain.

To summarize, the book does a good job in doing the title justice. Falls a bit on overt biases and downplaying of false accusations.

23 people found this helpful

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  • Amazon Customer
  • 22-08-22

Everyone should read this

This is definitely worth a listen because we need to be aware about dangerous inceldom.

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  • Elle Lace
  • 16-01-22

Informative - wasn't expecting to learn so much

I didn't think I was unaware of any of these issues, but I still discovered a lot of things throughout the book. Some parts were hard to listen to, but that's why we need to listen.
I've experienced a lot of the same things in this book and I kind of thought it was normal. It sounds absurd coming from someone else, though.
I say give the book a chance; the topics need awareness.

Lovely narration by the author.